Starmie

Special Sweeper Marzipan Man
Starmie @ Expert Belt / Wise Glasses / Choice Specs

Timid
252 Sp. ATK / 252 SPD / 6 HP

-Thunderbolt
-Surf
-Ice Beam
-Psychic / Grass Knot

Ability: Natural Cure

Standard sweeper Starmie. Timid nature is really needed to outrun mny things, especially Gengar. Your choice of item is pretty good here. Choice Specs obviously offer the most power, but they limit its versatility so you can use Wise Glasses for a bit of a boost. Expert Belt is also a good choice here as it hits 11 types for Super Effective.

Grass Knot and Psychic are equally good move choice in the fourth slot. Psychic gets STAB, but Grass Knot can hit bulkier threats like Suicune and Swampert. Psychic also has the disadvantage of not effecting Dark types, who are common counters to Starmie.

Counters
Blissey is the biggest one, as Starmie can't do much to her while she can Seismic Toss back and Softboiled off the damage as she goes. Cresselia can do much the same thing really, as can Snorlax.

Tyranitar and Weaville can both revenge kill her very easily with Pursuit, which will do heavy damage even if she stays in. Any Dark type can also do a lot of damage to her.

Starmie doesn't like any Electric, Grass, Dark, Ghost or Bug attacks very much though, so anything that can take a hit and strike back with a move of that type can counter her pretty well too.


Screwer of All Things Electivire Benim
Starmie @ Expert Belt

Modest / Timid
252 Sp. ATK / 252 SPD / 6 HP

-Skill Swap
-Surf
-Ice Beam
-Thunderbolt / Psychic / Grass Knot

Ability: Natural Cure

The obvious difference between this set and the above set is 'Skill Swap'. This gives it an amusing edge against Electivire. The best way to do this is to wait for the switch in and then Skill Swap. As he tries to Thunderpunch you, you'll catch a speed boost and be able to sweep even easier. You will also always beat an Electivire on speed unless its Scarfed, though thats fairly rare, hence a Modest nature can work here if you intend on getting a Speed Boost. This can also be used against Jolteon but you've got to Skill Swap on the switch as he's faster than you.

The final move is best of as Thunderbolt to BoltBeam, though Psychic and Grass Knot are still good choices if you want them. Surf and Ice Beam should always be used in addition to your third move.

Counters
Largely the same as above really. Special walls still absorb her shots. She also can't really swap for any interesting abilities againt the likes of Blissey, Sorlax and Cresselia, so they do a pretty good job.

Weaville and Tyranitar can still Pursuit her death, though if you get a Motor Drive boost, you can outspeed Weaville and kill a weakened one before he hits you.

Her large list of weaknesses is still there, so just exploit one of them. You could also predict a Skill Swapand switch in something with a bad ability - Truant or Slow Start maybe? However, this benefit will be short lived dueto Natural Cure being reset on withdrawl.

Bit of a questionable set, this. On one hand, Marzipan's got the basics, but lacks the fundamental grasp of the mechanics.

z.B: Recommending Modest over Timid, allowing you to be torn apart by all manner of Gengar.

Items really need to have Life Orb in there, especially if that comment at the bottom is going to stand. In fact, that comment should go entirely - Marzipan's got mixed up with sets.

I fully commented on this set wherever it was originally posted. I'll track it down and edit it in later.

Deepblade wrote:

Bit of a questionable set, this. On one hand, Marzipan's got the basics, but lacks the fundamental grasp of the mechanics.

z.B: Recommending Modest over Timid, allowing you to be torn apart by all manner of Gengar.

Items really need to have Life Orb in there, especially if that comment at the bottom is going to stand. In fact, that comment should go entirely - Marzipan's got mixed up with sets.

I must agree. I regret my choice (taken for the exact same reason as Marzipan Man) of going with Modest due to the amount of other Sweepers, Stamie's included, that have torn through my Modestness.

I do, however recommend Modest for Battle Revolution single player as nothing is EV trained in Speed there, meaning you just go first. This isn't about PBR, though, so Timid all the way.

I've edited the moveset with the suggested changes. If I've missed anything, tell me.

Twash_Man wrote:

Raylax wrote:

Screwer of All Things Electivire Benim
Starmie @ Expert Belt

Modest / Timid
252 Sp. ATK / 252 SPD / 6 HP

-Skill Swap
-Surf
-Ice Beam
-Thunderbolt / Psychic / Grass Knot

Ability: Natural Cure

I have a problem with the ability on this set. After thinking deeply about it, Illuminate would be a better Ability on this set. This is because the opponent can actually benefit from Natural Cure. For example, when Electivire switches in and gets Natural Cure, it wont be that affected by status, something that can really screw him over. So I suggest that you use Illuminate on this set instead, as it will also mess up other things like Porygon-Z while you take their Download. Other things that namely benefit from Natural Cure are

• Gyarados
  
• Salamence
  
• Gengar
  
• Yanmega

In fact, everything. These just utterly hate status.

Also, considering HP [Ground] with Skill Swap wouldnt be all that bad. If you got Gengar's Levitate or Weezing's Levitate you could hit them with HP [Ground] for quite a bit of damage, a tiny bit less again than Surf. It would also hit Magnezone for x4 damage, which is worth taking into consideration just for that. I would rather hit Maggy and a couple of others for x4 damage and hit lots with a attack which has 2 more power. On top of this, it would hit a couple more like Lanturn better. So..thats my argument.

I think it's all an argument of how much Starmie would be used up to the point of swapping skills. It probably wouldn't be too much time, so Natural Cure is an option IMO. We used to have HP Ground, but decided that it would only help with Magnezone (just one Pokemon) whereas Surf would hit everything that HP Ground hit for 2x harder, despite not being Super Effective.

Twash_Man wrote:

I know you decided that. However it can hit more than just Magnezone..I understand what you mean about Natural Cure but if you arent going to use Skill Swap, its a wasted move. I know you may not always use it, but you can mess up a counter, even if you just take Intimidate.

HP [Ground] hits Magnezone better, Lanturn better, Tentecruel better, Relicanth better, Venusaur better, Vileplume better, Victreebell better, and Roserade better. So it IS worth consideration.

The main purpose of Skill Swap is to counter Electivire, though you may be able to pick up other random abilities in battles. Natural Cure is the better option IMO as it will always be useful for you and considering this set has no status-inflicting moves, its probably not going to make a massive difference. Illuminate has much more selective uses than Natural Cure and I feel it would be of less use ultimately.

Magnezone is likely getting 2HKOed by Surf, so he's not switching in confidently, though for if he does, consider simply packing a Magnezone counter like Blissey.

Your list of Grass types is completely pointless since the set packs Ice Beam anyway which hits them harder. Tentacruel and Relicanth are hit by Thunderbolt for more than HP Ground would.

Lanturn counters this set as well as Electivire does since you can nick it's Volt Absorb and wear it down with Thunderbolt. Starmie just needs to watch out for Signal Beams.